I need warp speed and quick

[dystortid_r]

Hiya, I need speed and i need it fast. How do I go about increasing my speed in a hurry(speed metal, grindcore, etc...)

Any help would be great

Thanks and happy holidays to all

[cyberfret]

Playing fast takes consistent practice over time. Any attempt to find a "quick" solution will end up in injury. You can not develop the muscles necessary to play fast in a short period of time.

Start with the basic scales in this lessons
http://www.cyberfret.com/scales/basic/index.htm

Once you can play the scales up and down comfortably, try play them with some different patterns.

Here are a couple to start with. Once you understand the idea, you can come up with your own. All of the examples are written for an A major scale, but you should apply them to all scales. The numbers used to describe the scale patterns are just the order that you would play the notes in the scale.




Scale pattern 1231, 2342, 3453 etc...

E:-----------|---------|---------|-----------
B:-----------|---------|---------|-----------
G:-----------|---------|---------|-----------
D:-----------|---------|---------|-----4-----
A:-------4---|---4-5---|-4-5-7-4-|-5-7---5--- ETC....
E:---5-7---5-|-7-----7-|---------|-----------


You could do exactly the same thing coming back down

E:--4-5-7-4--|---4-5---|-----4---|------------
B:-----------|-7-----7-|-5-7---5-|---5-7------
G:-----------|---------|---------|-7-----7---- ETC....
D:-----------|---------|---------|------------
A:-----------|---------|---------|------------
E:-----------|---------|---------|------------




Or you could reverse the direction coming back down

E:--7-5-4-7--|--5-4---5-|--4-----4-|------------
B:-----------|------7---|----7-5---|-7-5---7----
G:-----------|----------|----------|-----7------ ETC....
D:-----------|----------|----------|------------
A:-----------|----------|----------|------------
E:-----------|----------|----------|------------



Here are some other patterns that you might try. If there are 2 or 4 notes in the sequence, play using 8th notes (2 times per beat) or 16th notes (4 times per beat). If there are 3 notes in the sequence, use 8th triplets (3 times per beat) , or 16th note triplets (6 times per beat).


Scale Patterns

1321, 2432, 3543.....
1234, 2345, 3456......
13, 24, 35.......


123, 234, 345.....
135, 246, 357....
121, 232, 343....
212, 323, 434...

Learn a challenging solo that requires some technique to play. Then you will be developing your technique while playing actual music. Write a song that has a technically challenging part in it.

Take it slow and work you way up. If you don't and try and massively practice in a short period of time, I guarantee that you will be sorry.

--Shawn

[Krieselman13]

I would have to agree with cyberfret. I did some reading up on the topic, and did find out that if you try to play too fast, you might get hurt, big time, or something like that (I cant realy remember what I read).

[barbietta]

Obviously everyone learns at a different pace, but I'd be curious to know general figures for how long it should take to develop different skills. Like speed for example. If someone puts a legitimate effort towards practicing the excercises Shawn spoke of, how long would it take to build up that kind of muscle strength, dexterity, coordination, etc.? A month or two? A year?

Another example. I've been working on one particular chord transition for over a month now, and while I've improved significantly, I still can't play it quickly without error. Is this common?

[hot_for_teacher]

u guys are pretty big on speed eh? dont u guys think that a good solo doesnt have to be fast??? sure i love great fast solos like yngwie malmsteen songs, and metallica stuff, but there are so many good solos out there that arent fast!! speed isnt everything!

[Levinson Blade]

I agree with Hot for teacher most songs that hit me with feeling are not at break neck speed

[Perfect4th]

Speed is not everything, but if you're trying to do anothers song and the solo is fast, well you got play it fast. If your playing with feeling and you feel fast you gotta go with the flow!

Peace!

[Chris Lohr]

Yes, just wondering cause the question wasnt answered yet:

About how long did it take you to build this fast speed?



Cause Ive been playing 2 years, and never work on speed exercises. The other day I tried playing fast and I surprised myself with how fast I could play.

so just wondering

[flexistential]

speed definitely isn't everything, and i dont think it is an attribute or skill that comes on its own no matter how hard you might focus on developing your speed alone...

i have been playing for about 10 years, and when i started i wanted to play super-fast blazing leads, that proved pretty much impossible as a beginner guitarist, your tendons and finger muscles just do not have the "minor motor movement" strength and dexterity to do what you want them to do even *if* you knew the the scales and licks to play...

so my focus moved away from speed toward learning chords, chord theory, scales, song writing, learning songs that were way beyond ability, and just plain messing around to find riffs and changes that were funky... i have recently got back into the blues in a big way, and people like SRV have got me into speed again, not for the sake of million notes a second tacky Vai style showboating, but precision improvisation that has *soul*... anyway having not really tried much in the speed dept. for a few years i was really surprised by how much faster i can improv and run full neck minor pentatonic and blues scales (*the* core scales) now... and i wasn;t even working on speed...

yikes, this had become a long boring post...sorry....

...my point... dont sit around thinking speed-speed-speed, it won't happen... practice *all* aspects of the guitar and aspects you did'nt even realize you were working on will improve because of it...

as for how long it takes... i don't know... it depends how much you want it:D

[coffin_joe]

i reckon a good lick for practicing speed is the master of puppets opening couple of riffs. i think there is a good tab at guitallica.com . sure speed aint everything but if all ya wanna learn is grindcore and that stuff then ya need it ay

[Poison God]

Hmm I'd say those riffs probobly help with your fast down stroke but not so much with speed. Download the Nevermore song This Sacrament and listen to the solo...
You can then get the tabs for the whole song on there site here
http://www.the.nl/nevermore/tablature.html
It's thier guitarist who tabbed it out.
Start slow... I still can't play it full speed but it is a good solo to practice speed...

[hopkins6]

Speed --- a good way to see if your getting faster is to find yourself a scale pattern or 2, and get a metronome, set it at a speed that you can handle, then every couple of days speed it up. Keep a journal so you can keep track of your progress, you'll be flying before you know it. peace:eek:

[Andrew]

i dont think anyone is really saying that speed is everything, sure, some of the best solos are slow, but it is frustrating when you want to learn a solo, but it is too fast.

[smfulla]

I agree, speed isn't everything, but.... who says that you can't have feel with speed?
And alot of the time, you need speed, just to suit the song. If you've got a fast and hard metal riff, you're not gunna play a solo that is is just wailing, you're gunna want some fast licks going on there

[se77en]

buy a grip master from musiciansfriend.com....it helps

[fizz]

those dont help with speed do they, i was under the impression that they were a little practise fretboard if you will, when you dont have your guitar handy, on the bus, in the car, etc. espviper said before -it would only tone up your forearm muscles?

[lepfan14]

If you really desire to play well and to practice correctly, check out guitarprinciples.com. It helped me a whole lot. In the mean time remember that if you try to play everything really fast you will injure yourself. Try to begin vey slow and RELAXED, do not allow your muscles to tense up. Good luck. I hope this helps.

[Mr B]

Buy one of those instruction videos by Paul Gilbert, where you can learn to alternate pick like a god.

[guitarg0d]

of course you can have feel with speed, Malmsteen - Blue, listen to that song and you will see what Im talking about. For those who think Vai, Satriani, Malmsteen are just technical, well you know nothing. They can use speed and they can play slow as well. Many guitarist cant play fast, thats why they play slow solos and say "less is more" and that soul **** as well, they are just not good because they never practiced enough...
So having two alternatives is the best thing...
I think paterns and scales are good to build up your speed.
guitartricks.com, check out the scales Malmsteen uses...

[suppaenitetere]

Thank you for insulting me/many styles of music/ideologies. Also thank you for allowing me to realize that i shouldnt take anything you say in the future for real. Afterall-Where would we be without guitar wanking?

[guitarg0d]

I am right and you know it.
I insulted nobody/style...
Maybe I insulted your ideology because its mediocre.
You dont want to practice, thats your problem, you will always be an underdog...

[suppaenitetere]

Damn, you got me!!! How is telling me what my problem is not insulting me?

Im really curious if you've ever listened to any music/guitarists beyond shred and guitar masturbation. People like shred and thats fine, whatever floats your boat. Im just trying to figure out how you are qualified to discount so many brilliant artists because they dont shred. BBking, Dave Gilmour, Lightning hopkins, Blind lemon jefferson, Charlie Christian(who it took jazz guitar 25 years to move beyond mind you), T bone walker, Chuck Berry, Robert Johnson (a man who legends were built around), John Mclaughlin(who has every ounce of speed/shred skill anyone ever thought of having, yet he knows when a note with all the emotion pulled out of it has more to say than a thousand others), John Lee Hooker, Howlin Wolf, and even Hendrix(The man knew when to hold the trigger and when to pull it) must have just been no talent hacks who didnt really want to practice.

I have no idea what to say to someone who says "that whole soul and feeling thing is nonsense-more notes is better!." Its like argueing with someone who refuses to believe the sky is blue.

[55'gibby]

being fast isn't important... spitting out a gazillion notes a second doesn't mean squat!!! it is being musical, it is playing with emotion, it is connecting with the audience that really matters. playing music isn't a race, it's a method of communication. I can pump out notes with the best of them, yet, I have never seen the need to do so. the ability to play fast only impresses guitarist (and not all of us), I have NEVER heard anyone after a concert say something like "that guitarist was great, he must have been around 20 notes per second tonight". for the life of me I cannot see the big deal about speed, guys like joe perry out sell and out draw vai, satch et al combined. yet joe perry is FAR from being the fastest (or best IMHO), yet, makes a far deeper connection to the folks he play for (which by the way is a FAR FAR larger audience). to judge a guitarist on speed alone is like judging a beauty contest by eye color alone, no matter how well you judge it your missing 99% of what your judging.

[55'gibby]

suppaenitetere, you missed a few... A FEW THOUSAND!!! like Roy Buchannan, d'jango, Zappa (although some of his stuff smoked), freddie king, buddy guy, sun house, tampa red... these are the guys have have driven the art of guitar to new levels and made generation of guitars want to play. having never really heard much satch or vai, and I still want to play and get better... something must be wrong with me, I must not understand talent

[Andrew]

I have no idea what to say to someone who says "that whole soul and feeling thing is nonsense-more notes is better!." Its like argueing with someone who refuses to believe the sky is blue.:rolleyes:

No one said that. No one thinks that. Of course slow solos can be great. Speed is just another thing thing that helps makes a good, well rounded guitarist. If someone posted looking for help with hammer-ons, or palm muting, would you start posting 'I cannot see the big deal about hammer-ons' or 'palm muting isn't everything'.


having never really heard much satch or vai

No one with opinions like your's has. No one who has actually listened to Vai or Satch thinks that. Go out and buy 'Passion and Warfare'.

[suppaenitetere]

I also dont know what to say to people who cant read... and i quote "thats why they play slow solos and say "less is more" and that soul **** as well."

As for your comments on the technique thing, i totally agree and i never said speed was a bad thing to be able to do. I was replying to guitarg0d who said, essentially "you suck and are lazy if you dont have speed."

I have listened to satch and vai and find them sterile and boring. That whole no soul thing and i still hold that opinion. I also think you're taking gibby's comment out of context(that whole reading thing again) but ill leave that for him.

[Andrew]

I'm pretty sure guitarg0d was not complaining about people who play slow solos, but about people using 'feel' and 'soul' as an excuse because they can't play fast.

[55'gibby]

No one with opinions like your's has. No one who has actually listened to Vai or Satch thinks that.

HARUMPH!!

I seen Steve Vai this summer in concert (free tics), went to see if I missed something in the recordings that I heard. The answer: Nope.

he is very techically sound, and can play blazingly fast. his music says nothing that hasn't been said better by someone else. quite frankly, after about 20 minutes I heard his whole thing and had enough. I found his arrangements uninspired, the band was just here to fill in behind his solos, his song were pretty much undisernable from one to another. what did I learn, guys like vai and satch aren't for me. if you like them and your trying to play like them then go for it, don't let me stop ya. I feel he plays fast just cuz he can play fast, not that it adds anything to his songs. it's not anything against speed, I love to listen to guys like McLaughlin, DiMeola, DeLuca, and Coryell all of theses guys can spit out notes it great gobs. the difference is that when those guys do it it moves the piece of music along, and it's done with great emotion... in other words, for a reason.

[Perfect4th]

Originally posted by guitarg0d
You dont want to practice, thats your problem, you will always be an underdog...

I don't think it's a matter of practice, I think it's a matter of taste. Supp doesn't like shred! That's OK, isn't it?

I like shred, blues, bluegrass, classical...really just about anything except RAP. I hate RAP, I think RAP sucks. But if it rocks someone elses boat, great! Just don't expect me to listen.

Peace!

[Pezcore]

i must admit im with suppaenitetere and gibby here.

Having bought and listened to both vai and satch albums i must admit i was a little disapointed, both lacked any kind of emotion in their playing and quite frankly i was bored.

i'm not having a dig at satch/vai fans here, people like what they like and im in no way entitled to judge by it, but as gibby mentioned, people like Al DiMeola can play along at a fairly fast pace, but the difference is they're interesting to listen to.


damn it wheres Paul Kossoff when you need him....

-Pez

[55'gibby]

Pez... you find out where he is, I bring the shovel and we can dig him up... I do like his (PK) style

[Andrew]

I like paul kossof. not known as well as he should be.

Most of the people who I have talked to who don't like Vai and Satch haven't actually heard the music. I can't say if that is true about you people but I have a pretty good idea. Anyway, the reason people think this is because they believe what they have heard from other people and dont bother listening to the music. So if you are reading this, go and listen to the music with an open mind and make up your mind for yourself.


I don't think it's a matter of practice, I think it's a matter of taste. Supp doesn't like shred! That's OK, isn't it?

Absolutely. But i dont think it is good to go around telling people 'vai is boring and sterile'. Let them make their minds up for themselves. Vai is and hopefully will be a big source of inspiration for thousands of guitarists. Don't take that away from people.


55'Gibby

You like Zappa. Zappa thought enough of Vai to have him in his band.

You like Al Di Meola. If he had long hair, played an Ibanez RG and recorded all his songs in the late 80s, would you still like him? I don't think so.

You have a pretty wide taste in music. I like most of the stuff you like, plus people like Vai and Satch. Don't ignore music because of its image.


Here is a quote from Steve Vai - "Playing fast is fun, but it is only one small element"

[suppaenitetere]

Man this is the thread that just wont die... anyway

Im not saying they are sterile and boring as a fact. Im saying i feel like they are and thats why id ont like them. My saying that shouldnt affect anyone elses opinion. I have listened to them and so has gibby (he even went to a vai concert)but i still think they're sterile and boring. As for Zappa and Vai thats totally different. Zappa was something totally out there and Vai was under Zappas creative supervision. When Vai got out on his own he lost zappas magic and turned into what he is now... at least thats my take. As for the quote on vai practice what you preach.

[jaytee]

oh my god! i hit the 666th view of this thread....lol....so i had to hit it again to be 667 as well....

ok i aint lookin to get involved in this really...but i think you should go back and reread everything youve written and realize how much youve contradicted yourself from post to post (or at least how much it LOOKS like you did...perhaps things are being misunderstood)....and NO im not gonna tell you who thats pointed at so no one should feel like im taking sides.....

anyhow....heres MY quote....found in the oct 2002 issue of Guitar Player magazine...
Josh Homme of Queens of the Stone Age said:
"There's something inherent in playing the guitar that, if you go searching for technical excellence, you never get anything *but* technical excellence. You lose everything that's cool about your playing. Look at Malcolm Young. Do you have any idea how much discipline it takes to be Malcolm Young? He knows so much, and he can do so much more, but he doesn't play that way on *purpose*. Anyone can play hot leads for days, but try *not* doing it and see how bad-ass you are."


no i dont really follow QotSA, but here is a working musician whose been in the industry for years and leans toward the idea that technical ability shouldnt define music....

--jt

[Andrew]

technical ability shouldnt define music....

:confused: I didn't say that technical ability should define music. No one in their right mind would.


As for the quote on vai practice what you preach.

Vai doesn't play fast at all on a large number of his songs.( I was going to name some but there are too many.)


Zappa was something totally out there and Vai was under Zappas creative supervision. When Vai got out on his own he lost zappas magic and turned into what he is now

Are you trying to say that anyone is good if they are in Zappa's band? But as soon as they leave it they 'lose the magic' and become 'sterile'? Sounds like you are the one who is 'somewhere totally out there'.


Man this is the thread that just wont die... anyway

I agree. I probably won't be posting on this thread again. Leave Vai and Satch to the people with more open minds. It is your loss.

[suppaenitetere]

I was really impressed with this thread in that it kept from turning into personal insults but a debate on the nature of music(with the exception of guitarg0d). I guess it had to end sooner or later.

[discoglen]

not necessarily.....